30-30 Ammunition, A Historic Cartridge Continues to Carry On : Load Testing

Reloader, Bob Shell, tests a range of assorted powders loads and bullet weights in 30-30 Ammunition and finds it still is an effective round 120+ years later.
Editors Note: Caution, Reloading is dangerous, read our “Reloading Disclaimer“. The reloading data published by this website is intended for discussion purposes only. As with all data collection, mistakes are possible. You have been warned.**

.30-30 Ammunition Ammo Cartridges Loads
.30-30 Ammunition Ammo Cartridges Loads. often overlooked are reduced and cast bullet loads.

Apache Junction, AZ –-(Ammoland.com)- One of the very first smokeless rounds designed for sporting purposes was the 30-30 cartridge introduced in the Winchester model 94 rifle.

It became generally available in 1895. The original factory ammo offering was a 160 grain at 2,000 FPS.

In that day such velocities were almost unheard of. Typical black powder rounds usually produced 12 to 1400FPS. While 2,000 FPS sounds pedestrian by today’s standards, it did the job and hunters quickly realized that this was the wave of the future. For much of the woods hunting the 30-30 has plenty of power. Later on, the 150 and 170-grain bullets were added, and velocity increased.

A few years later other manufacturers realized the potential of the 30-30 ammunition round and brought out their versions as the Winchester model 94 rifle was selling like hotcakes, and they wanted a piece of the pie.

303 Savage Rifle and Ammo
303 Savage Rifle and Ammo

Savage brought out the 303 Savage also in a lever action though it had a box type of magazine and Remington introduced the 30 Remington round in some pump and semi-auto rifles. I have owned and shot all of them, and ballistically they are virtually identical to the 30-30. It would be a personal choice as to the type of gun as they all perform the same. The 30 Remington and 303 Savage were popular for some years, but they are no longer made. Guns can still be found as well as ammo and reloading components with a little shopping.

However, the 30-30 Ammunition Cartridge is as popular as ever.

One of the companies that makes manually operated firearms have been around for a number of years and they advertise that everything is made in America. Another unusual thing is they advertise on TV which few others do. Evidently it works or they would drop it. If you want something different you should definitely check out Henry Arms. They have a large variety of rifles including rimfires. They have the mares leg handgun, a lever action in 410 gauge and the Henry 45-70 rifle among other arms. Single shot shotguns are available as well. For info you can go to www.henryusa.com for info.

Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle

Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle
Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle

One of their products is a lever action rifle chambered for the 30-30 in various models. My model is a Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle, model H009 which is a blued steel model with a round barrel.

It is drilled and tapped for a top mounted scope which will enhance accuracy beyond a hundred yards. A Hawke scope is the planned one for this review. I have used the Hawke on many occasions and they always come through. They are reasonably priced and the rifle selection is good so for info you can go to us.hawkeoptics.com on their products. For a budget conscious hunter who wants a good scope at a reasonable price, you would be missing out if you don’t check the HAWK Scopes out. I have done quite a bit of testing with this scope and everything checks out. It is clear at all ranges and power settings. With this scope, you have the ability to take a long shot if available and using something like the Flex Tip bullet. Based on my experiences with the Hawke brand I recommend it.

Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle with a Hawk Riflescope
Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle with a Hawk Riflescope

The wood of the Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle has a pleasing figure while the bluing is not glossy but even. Another odd feature is it loads by a tube under the barrel as many 22 RF guns do. Most 30-30 lever guns load through the receiver. There is no politically correct safety of any kind which is a plus. Common sense gun handling tends to prevent those types of accidents. The trigger pull is good not too light or heavy.

Caution Loading the Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle, your hand may be in front of the barrel.
Caution Loading the Henry Lever Action .30-30 Rifle, your hand may be in front of the barrel.

We did find that the lever screw and a tang screw were loose. Not a big deal but perhaps they might want to look at during production.One other thing we noticed is the way it loads. Most people will put a round in the chamber in order to get the seven rounds. However, when loading the tube your hand may be in front of the muzzle at various times. So, if the chamber has a round in it and is cocked a small misstep may cause it to fire. Such an incident may cause a serious hand injury so be careful see pix.

One thing that was noticeable is the figure on the stock. It has some of the most attractive wood I have seen for a while. Yes, composite stocks are more durable but if looks are important to you then this rifle will definitely have a place in your cabinet.

There are other chamberings and styles available plus some shotguns. So why a 30-30 rifle? It has been around for over 120 years, and one would think that it would be obsolete and no longer made. Nothing is further from the truth. There are several other rifle makers, and the Henry 30-30 is one of the top sellers. Most are lever guns, but some single shot and bolt action rifles are available. The 30-30 round has been used by many hunters, and when used as designed it produces good results often ending with a deer in the pot. It is usually considered a woods gun meant for moderate ranges. However, with the new and improved powders and flex tips the range can be extended. Some people feel that as long as a bullet produces 1,000 FT-LBS of energy at the target, it is considered adequate for deer sized game. With Hornady Flex Tip bullets that number can be obtained at 300 yards with safe loads and regular lever action.

30-30 Cartidge Loadings

Here are some examples when the powder charged is increased by one grain. Some brands of bullets were more consistent than others which is normal. That is why if you are working up a load for serious purposes it is important to try different powder and bullet combos. Each gun has its preferences.

LOAD BULLET VELOCITY MY COMMENTS
32gr RL #7 110gr FMJ-RN 2521.6 Very Consistent
18gr 5744 150gr Berry 1478.9 Consistent
Barnes 150gr Vortex 2404.6 Good Hunting Load
32gr 8208 150gr Speer 2212 Ok but can increase
33gr 8208 150gr Horn 2263.36 Ok
34gr H-4895 150gr Combined 2304.4 Decent
37gr CFE-223 150gr Horn 2250.55 Very Consistent
37gr Leverrevolution 150gr Barns 2385 Nice Load
36.5gr Leverrevolution 160gr Flex 2335 Long Range Potential
Hornday 160gr Flex Tip 2369.80 Nice Load
18gr 5744 160gr Cast 1573.89 Consistent
10gr Unique Mossberg 165gr cast 1347.60 Very Consistent
10gr Unique Henry 165gr cast 1336.44 Very Consistent
31gr 8208 170gr Speer 2060.71 Deer Load
32gr 8208 170gr Speer 2107.4 Consistent
35gr Leverrevolution 180gr Horn RN 2144 Consistent
30gr 8208 180g Horn RN 2008.8 Decent
14gr 5744 220 gr cast GC 1286.7 Ok Load

Just for info, the 10 grains of Unique and the 165 gr cast was fired in a Mossberg and Henry both lever actions and a 20” barrel. The results were very similar, and Unique is one of the very best powders for reduced loads.

For those who are interested in the potential of a 30-30 at different ranges here is some info that may help.

150 grain RN

Muzzle 2390/1902 – 100 yards 1959/1278 – 200 yards 1581/832

160 grain Hornady FTX which is a pointed bullet safe in a tubular magazine.

Muzzle 2400/2046 – 100 yards 2150/1636 – 200 yards 1916/1309 – 300 yards 1699/1025

As you can see the 150 grain drops below 1000 LBS before reaching 200 yards while the FTX extends the range to 300 yards a 35% increase in usable range. The 170-grain flat point launched at 2200 FPS drops below 1000 FP LBS of energy at over 150 yards so the 160 grain FTX would double the useful range. Therefore it would be a mistake to sell the 30-30 short.

30-30 Cast Bullets
30-30 Cast Bullets
Right: 30-30 160 gr flex tip gives the 30-30 more range. / Left : If a bullets lacks a cannelure it can be installed with a small tool.
Right: 30-30 160 gr flex tip gives the 30-30 more range. – Left : If a bullets lacks a cannelure it can be installed with a small tool.
30-30 110 & 150Gr Bullets
30-30 110 & 150Gr Bullets

I wanted to see what 30-30 ammunition could do in a stronger rifle and I have a TC single shot and used it for the test.

I wont be listing the loads here as someone would try them in a lever action which could cause a catastrophic event. It would probably hold them but would cause excess wear and could damage the gun. So why take the chance especially if you don’t understand the ramifications of using such loads.

For this experiment, here is list of the top velocity of the bullets tested. It will become obvious quickly that these velocities are quite a bit above normal and I know that they are that is why the loading data isn’t included. If you have a TC or strong bolt action then these velocities can be safely obtained. This is a little off the subject but it shows that the 30-30 is more than just a short-range woods load. The Henry rifle is well built and has as good an action as any 30-30 but I would not try these loads in it. If you were carrying a 30-30 in grizzly country them one of the heavy bullets may serve but for 99% of us the factory spec loads will do just fine. These are the velocities obtained in a single shot rifle.

Bullet Weight Velocity
110gr RN 2897
123gr 2730
150gr 2637
165gr 2392
180gr 2304
200gr 2232
220gr 2053
30 Caliber Cartridges
30 Caliber Cartridges : L to R 303 savage, 30-30, and 30 Remington. They have similar performance but the Savage & Remington are obsolete.

Factory 30-30 ammunition is usually produced with a 150 or 170 grain bullet. That takes care of most hunting situations that a 30-30 should be used for. Recently they added a 160 grain Flex Tip which enhances its range. One thing that puzzles me is they never offered a 180 or 190 grain RN. The 303 Savage offered it in the 190 grains at one time and it had a good reputation.

The 180 would give a little extra penetration if you were hunting large black bear or large boar. They shoot well and have their uses through a 150 or 170 would cover deer and similar game. The Hornady 180 grain feeds ok but care must be taken to seat deep enough in fact with any gun and ammo types you should cycle them before you go hunting. You can’t seat it in the cannelure, doing so will make it too long. Since it has a long neck a cannelure isn’t needed. However, if you have a bullet that needs that procedure that is an easy task. I have a CH cannelure tool which comes in handy on many occasions. In the last decade or so factory ammo has improved a lot.

In fact, it can be a challenge to do better than the factory loads. The only downside is the cost. An indication of how popular round is the variety offered by various ammo companies. Hornady a leading ammo maker offers 5 different loads for this round. For more info, you can go to www.hornady.com/ammunition for a listing on their products. Another fine ammo maker is Barnes. They brought out the copper bullets which have turned out to be great hunting bullets. They offer the 30-30 ammunition in the 150 gr Vor Tex and they shoot well for info you can go to www.barnesbullets.com for more info.

Handloading, the 30-30 ammunition, brings out the potential and with a Henry rifle with the Hawke scope your usable range will increase. Some hunters tend to look down on the 30-30 ammunition as obsolete and no longer effective. Apparently, since 1895 deer have grown tougher and may have some armor at least that so is the thought process for many when buying a rifle these days. They go with the short, medium and long magnums for woods hunting. They feel that a bullet screaming along at over 3000 FPS is needed to kill a deer at moderate ranges.

After some years pass some of those super magnums will be a footnote while 30-30 ammunition will carry on.


Bob Shell
Bob Shell

About Bob Shell

A Custom Reloader of Obsolete and Antique Ammo, Bob Shell, writes about the subject of Guns, Ammo, Shooting and Related Subjects. Visit: www.bobshellsblog.blogspot.com

The post 30-30 Ammunition, A Historic Cartridge Continues to Carry On : Load Testing appeared first on AmmoLand.com.

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“Lying to federal investigators can carry a five-year prison sentence, though McCabe disputes that he intentionally misled anyone.”

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Pizza Place Employee Defends Himself From Mask Wearing Attacker

A lot of businesses have policies against their employees being armed. Yes, I know there are a lot of reasons for these policies, but the reality is that they don’t do much except disarm those employees and prevent them from defending themselves.

As a result, a lot of employees ignore those laws. They figure their life is more important than their job, an argument I wouldn’t be able to disagree with even if I were so inclined, which I’m not.

I’m not sure whether the Little Caesars in Holly Hill, Florida has such a policy, but at least one employee was glad he was armed.

The Little Caesars employee was closing up shop when a man in a bloody demon mask approached and attacked him. The masked man repeatedly hit the employee with a large piece of wood, knocked him to ground, and attempted to stab him. During the assault, the employee managed to draw his legally concealed firearm shoot the masked man.

The employee then called police and requested medical assistance for himself and his attacker.

“Please help me,” the employee told a 911 dispatcher. “He tried to stab me with a pair of scissors. He hit me in the face with a big piece of wood. I’m bleeding all over the place.”

Police arrived a few minutes later and rushed the masked man to Halifax Health Medical Center where he was pronounced dead. Holly Hill police Chief Steve Aldrich praised the employee for being able to effectively defend himself.

“As soon as he exited the building, he was immediately attacked by an individual that was wearing a scary clown mask and brandishing a wooden stick,” Aldrich told WFTV. “Even though he’s being attacked he’s able to pull out a concealed firearm he has and fires multiple rounds at the suspect. I’m glad that he was able to defend himself and that he’s OK. It’s just unfortunate that this whole episode occurred.”

There are no charges pending against the employee, thankfully, and the bad guy is dead as a doornail.

However, it appears they still don’t know who the attacker is or what exactly his motivation for the attack was. There’s no indication that robbery was the motive, nor does it appear to have been someone the victim knew. It’s just kind of a bizarre, brutal attack that was cut short by a citizen carrying a firearm.

Funny how that shakes out, isn’t it?

There has been no mention of the employee being fired over carrying a gun, so that’s a bit of good news. I get angry when businesses fire people who defend their own lives in spite of a store policy that would have gotten them killed. Again, I understand the reasons many of those businesses have those policies, but that doesn’t make them any less stupid.

Cases like this illustrate just why they’re dumb. Here is a man who would have been murdered in a brutal attack had he been disarmed by store policy. Instead, he’s alive and recovering from the attack while his attacker…well, not so much.

Folks, it can’t be said any clearer: guns save lives.

The post Pizza Place Employee Defends Himself From Mask Wearing Attacker appeared first on Bearing Arms.

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Surprise! The Iranians may have been cooking up long-range ballistic missiles all during the time that both Tehran and the Obama administration downplayed those possibilities. As far back as 2011 or earlier, Iran has operated a secret missile-development site near Shahrud, the New York Times reported. For those keeping score, that would be four years before the US agreed to a deal that did nothing to restrain such activities:

When an explosion nearly razed Iran’s long-range missile research facility in 2011 — and killed the military scientist who ran it — many Western intelligence analysts viewed it as devastating to Tehran’s technological ambitions.

Since then, there has been little indication of Iranian work on a missile that could reach significantly beyond the Middle East, and Iranian leaders have said they do not intend to build one.

That might explain why the Obama administration didn’t link missile development to the “bar” on Iran’s nuclear-weapons programs. That’s pretty weak sauce, though, considering how many test launches Iran made both before and after the JCPOA. They clearly were working toward some missile development, and they already had medium-range missile systems operational. Remember, Iranian leaders also insisted for two decades that they had no intention of building a nuclear weapon either, demonstrating the credibility of the regime when it comes to its stated military goals.

If that truly was the basis of ignoring missile development in the JCPOA, it’s not a very comforting thought. The truth behind the secret facility turned out to be fairly easy to uncover … once anyone put some effort into it:

So, this spring, when a team of California-based weapons researchers reviewed new Iranian state TV programs glorifying the military scientist, they expected a history lesson with, at most, new details on a long-dormant program.

Instead, they stumbled on a series of clues that led them to a startling conclusion: Shortly before his death, the scientist, Gen. Hassan Tehrani Moghaddam, oversaw the development of a secret, second facility in the remote Iranian desert that, they say, is operating to this day.

This raises serious questions, such as: Did the Obama administration know about this facility when it agreed to the JCPOA? If not, how did it get missed? Does this facility have other purposes, such as, oh … nuclear-weapons development? The outsiders who managed to connect dots to the Shahrud facility can’t answer all the questions from satellite photos alone:

It is possible that the facility is developing only medium-range missiles, which Iran already possesses, or perhaps an unusually sophisticated space program.

But an analysis of structures and ground markings at the facility strongly suggests, though does not prove, that it is developing the technology for long-range missiles, the researchers say.

For its part, Tehran refuses to discuss any kind of limitation on missile development — at least for now:

Defense Minister Amir Hatami said on Wednesday that Iran would never compromise on its missile power, reiterating Tehran’s long held position that Iran’s missile power is of defensive nature, Fars reported.

Responding to U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo’s remarks on Iran’s missile power, Hatami said, “If the Islamic Republic wanted to pay attention to such delusional remarks over the past 40 years, it wouldn’t have gained such power, glory and dignity.”

ICBMs are not defensive weapons. They are by nature offensive weapons, used as a deterrent in some contexts, but the deterrent value lies in their offensive nature. They are designed to strike long distances away from borders and frontiers as a means of extending offensive capabilities. Paired with a nuclear-weapons program, they become an even greater offensive threat, one that would destabilize the entire region.

Defenders of the JCPOA will argue that the deal eliminated the threat of that pairing, but that’s nonsense. Even if Iran abided by the terms of the JCPOA, it would only have had to wait ten years to produce a nuclear weapon. Having an ICBM platform available for a nuclear warhead to fit it would fit perfectly into a strategy of dominating the region by nuclear blackmail, and would force others in the region to develop or acquire their own systems to counter it.

This is just another reminder that we cut a deal with a terrorist state that didn’t do anything to restrict its terrorist or its ability to develop platforms for later use against us. If anything, the JCPOA provided financial support for these efforts and others in the region, fueling conflict and pushing Iranian hegemony all the way to the Mediterranean, all without getting anything in return other than a piece of paper. We didn’t even get American detainees out of Iran. It’s a complete debacle, only becoming even more apparent with the passage of time.

The post NYT: Say, Iran may be building ICBMs after all appeared first on Hot Air.

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Prosecutors allege that between November 2010 and December 2013, Lischewski conspired with two rival companies to keep the prices high. Three more executives, two from Bumble Food and one from StarKist have all pleaded guilty to price fixing.

Assistant Attorney General Makan Delrahim remarked: “American consumers deserve free enterprise, not fixed prices, so the department will not tolerate crimes like the one charged in today’s indictment.”

Lischewski’s attorney, John Keker, however, maintains that his client is innocent, noting: “When the facts are known and the truth emerges, Mr. Lischewski will be found not guilty, and that vindication will rightfully restore his good name.”

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These three companies account for around 74% of the US canned tuna market and supply retailers like Walmart, Kroger and Albertsons, who sued the three firms for fixing prices in 2016. Former senior vice president for sales at StarKist, Stephen Hodge, pleaded guilty last year to price-fixing and two other Bumble Bee Foods executives pleaded guilty to the scheme, with the company agreeing to pay a $25 million fine.

Many people have weighed in with comments on the Daily Mail’s coverage of the criminal business practices, with one commenter noting: “Totally believe this. I remember tuna was really expensive a couple years ago” and another saying, “I won’t buy Bumble Bee any more.”

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Thanks to Seattle’s many thriving businesses, its revenue base has been growing much faster than its population. Unfortunately, the City Council is doing what it does best and, rather than look into streamlining and cutting its ineffective spending programs in order to combat Seattle’s homeless problem, is looking for fresh cash. Seeing as large companies have it, the council set out to take it.

The result is the so-called head tax on Seattle businesses that gross at least $20 million annually. According to The Seattle Times, 585 businesses in the city will be subject to the tax. Not surprisingly, the tech giant Amazon is expected to pay the most under the tax. The initial proposal was for a $500 tax per employee, which, in Amazon’s case, would have meant an added $20 million in labor costs. Thanks to a veto threat from the mayor, the council reduced its tax grab to $275 per employee.

When the tax was initially proposed, the company announced that under those circumstances, it was going to pause construction planning for a new giant office tower on its new downtown campus. If you employed 40,000 people and realized that you might always be the target of revenue-addicted bureaucrats, you might do the same. But those who constantly lust over other people’s money have no shame. A union-backed activist group named Working Washington immediately called for—wait for it—Amazon to be charged with a felony for the crime of “intimidating a public servant.” Simply questioning whether its business expansion in Seattle would be a good idea in the face of an arbitrary and substantial increase of its labor costs was the alleged crime.

Of course, what Amazon did is no different from what many taxpayers do when taxes increase to cover poor money management. I, for instance, am in the process of deciding whether I really want to continue offering my home through Airbnb now that Arlington County, Virginia, requires a business license to rent a room in one’s own home, a 7.25 percent tax and filing a monthly tax return for the unit.

Thank goodness, in Seattle, the state’s attorney general stepped in and informed everyone that no crime had been committed and no legal action would be taken. Basically, it isn’t illegal yet in Seattle to contemplate the best path for your business when the taxman comes after you. But a statement by a Working Washington spokesman should trouble the company, as it’s an indication that this is only the beginning. It reads: “It is extraordinary that Amazon’s subprime mob boss behavior was so brutal it ignited a citywide debate over whether it was actually criminal. All that because the richest man in the world wants to try to avoid stepping up to address our city’s homelessness crisis.”

There’s no point talking about all the ways that statement is shocking and over-the-top scary. But it’s worth noting that Amazon does its share when it comes to filling the Seattle treasury’s coffers through its business and sales taxes, the income taxes paid by its 40,000 employees (up from 5,000 in 2010) and the real estate taxes they all pay. And never mind that Amazon has donated half of a six-story building to a homeless shelter, according to The New York Times, “providing it with 47,000 square feet of space with private rooms that can hold 65 families, or about 220 people and their pets.”

Besides, this head tax won’t be paid by Amazon. Companies don’t pay taxes. People ultimately pay taxes. That means that this tax will come out of the wages of future employees, the bonuses and wage growth of current employees, the dividends of shareholders, and the pockets of customers, who will face higher prices. It could also lead to the longer-term decision by Amazon to shrink its Seattle operation for the benefit of its second headquarters, the location of which is still being decided. Other cities should take note. Don’t repeat Seattle’s mistake.

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